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  #1  
Old 05-16-2013, 10:57 AM
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Wiggy Starts at 1st today and No Jay

NOT the Official BoTB Game Thread...just letting everyone get prepared...

LINEUPS:

CARDS LINEUP:

1. Carpenter 2B

2. Robinson CF

3. Beltran RF

4. Craig LF

5. Molina C

6. Freese 3B

7. Wigginton 1B

8. Kozma SS

9. Wainwright, P

MUTS LINEUP:

1. Valdespin RF

2. Murphy 2B

3. Wright 3B

4. Davis 1B

5. Duda LF

6. Buck C

7. Ankiel CF

8. Tejada SS

9. Niese P
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  #2  
Old 05-16-2013, 11:01 AM
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In fairness, standing stock still and 'coaxing' a wild-pitch was the best AB Wiggy's given us this year.

So I have no problem rewarding him with a start after such a marked improvement over his early performances.
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  #3  
Old 05-16-2013, 11:04 AM
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Wigginton sucked when he was good. I don't get this experiment.
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  #4  
Old 05-16-2013, 11:19 AM
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Wigginton sucked when he was good. I don't get this experiment.
The PD article says he has had success against Niese...I think 4 for 10......we'll see..

The more we B&M about it here the better he'll do today.....
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  #5  
Old 05-16-2013, 11:30 AM
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Matt Adams can pplay 1st! Why didn't they give him a chance.
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  #6  
Old 05-16-2013, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Oz-iz-God View Post
In fairness, standing stock still and 'coaxing' a wild-pitch was the best AB Wiggy's given us this year.

So I have no problem rewarding him with a start after such a marked improvement over his early performances.
He's going to extend his career as a pinch-runner.
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  #7  
Old 05-16-2013, 11:34 AM
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Matt Adams can pplay 1st! Why didn't they give him a chance.
Because Niese is a lefty.....the same (stupid) reason that Adams was lifted for a PH lastnight before stepping to the plate.
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  #8  
Old 05-16-2013, 12:20 PM
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Wainwright has been so good this year and Niese so bad, that they should be able to start the AAA lineup and win today.
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  #9  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:02 PM
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I like Beltran in the three hole. They should keep him there and let Holliday bat fifth.

The only problem with that setup is most days, the first two (Carp & Jay ) bat lefthanded.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:08 PM
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Wainwright looks sharp today.
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  #11  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:18 PM
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Kozma does it again with an RBI double. That's 15 RBI from the eight hole.
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"Human decency is not derived from religion. It precedes it." Christopher Hitchens

"Liberalism is trust of the people tempered by prudence. Conservatism is distrust of the people tempered by fear." William E. Gladstone, 1866

"When women understand that governments and religions are human inventions; that bibles, prayer-books, catechisms, and encyclical letters are all emanations from the brain of man, they will no longer be oppressed by the injunctions that come to them with the divine authority of thus saith the Lord." Elizabeth Cady Stanton

"When you look at the history of what we know about the world, you see a very noticeable pattern. Natural explanations of things have been replacing supernatural explanations of them. Like a steamroller." Greta Christina
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  #12  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:19 PM
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Kozma does it again with an RBI double. That's 15 RBI from the eight hole.
At some point, we may have to resign ourselves to the fact that he can play baseball.
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  #13  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:29 PM
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Not really a bad pitch from Wainright there, just a damn nice piece of hitting from a good hitter in Wright.
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  #14  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:31 PM
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Good idea by Valdespin to bunt with 2 outs in front of Murphy.
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  #15  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:44 PM
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Don't run on Yadi, bitch.
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  #16  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:55 PM
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Good idea by Valdespin to bunt with 2 outs in front of Murphy.
Have to assume this is sarcasm.
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"Human decency is not derived from religion. It precedes it." Christopher Hitchens

"Liberalism is trust of the people tempered by prudence. Conservatism is distrust of the people tempered by fear." William E. Gladstone, 1866

"When women understand that governments and religions are human inventions; that bibles, prayer-books, catechisms, and encyclical letters are all emanations from the brain of man, they will no longer be oppressed by the injunctions that come to them with the divine authority of thus saith the Lord." Elizabeth Cady Stanton

"When you look at the history of what we know about the world, you see a very noticeable pattern. Natural explanations of things have been replacing supernatural explanations of them. Like a steamroller." Greta Christina
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  #17  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:56 PM
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At some point, we may have to resign ourselves to the fact that he can play baseball.
I'm not there yet.

I'm glad to get this production out of him, however.
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  #18  
Old 05-16-2013, 01:58 PM
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I'm not there yet.

I'm glad to get this production out of him, however.
Rich,

Liberal economists are renowned for their ability to watch something work in practice and wondering if it will work in theory.
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  #19  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:05 PM
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At some point, we may have to resign ourselves to the fact that he can play baseball.
John, I think "at some point" is where most of us are at right now.

Pete might have caused Maxvill to become a backup. I just wish he had a Javier-type personality and glove to compliment him and to help his savvy grow.

I don't think we've seen the best from Kozma yet. He's quiet. He has heart and time will tell.
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  #20  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:06 PM
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At some point, we may have to resign ourselves to the fact that he can play baseball.
Most of the angst regarding Kozma comes from the belief that he was a reach as the #18 pick of the 2007 draft. Porcello was the player many clamored for at the time. Looking back, here are the all of the 1st round picks from 2007 drafted 18th or later, ranked by career WAR.

Code:

                      
Pick Team Player Pos WAR 54 Rangers Tommy Hunter RHP 4.2 27 Tigers Rick Porcello RHP 3.9 34 Reds Todd Frazier 3B 3.8 28 Twins Ben Revere OF 3.6 21 Blue Jays J.P. Arencibia C 3.4 38 Blue Jays Brett Cecil LHP 3.3 48 Cubs Josh Donaldson C 2.8 35 Rangers Julio Borbon OF 2.4 63 Padres Cory Luebke LHP 2.4 41 Athletics Sean Doolittle 1B 1.7 18 Cardinals Pete Kozma SS 1.2 25 White Sox Aaron Poreda LHP 0.4 59 Athletics Corey Brown OF 0.2 30 Yankees Andrew Brackman RHP 0.1 36 Cardinals Clayton Mortensen RHP 0.1 32 Giants Nick Noonan 2B -0.1 19 Phillies Joe Savery LHP -0.2 42 Mets Eddie Kunz RHP -0.2 51 Giants Charlie Culberson 2B -0.2 52 Mariners Matt Mangini 3B -0.2 56 Blue Jays Trystan Magnuson RHP -0.2 55 Red Sox Nick Hagadone LHP -0.7 20 Dodgers* Chris Withrow RHP 22 Giants Tim Alderson RHP 23 Padres Nick Schmidt LHP 24 Rangers Michael Main RHP 26 Athletics James Simmons RHP 29 Giants Wendell Fairley OF 31 Nationals Josh Smoker LHP 33 Braves Jon Gilmore 3B 37 Phillies Travis d'Arnaud C 39 Dodgers James Adkins LHP 40 Padres Kellen Kulbacki OF 43 Giants Jackson Williams C 44 Rangers Neil Ramirez RHP 45 Blue Jays Justin Jackson SS 46 Padres Drew Cumberland SS 47 Mets Nathan Vineyard LHP 49 Nationals Michael Burgess OF 50 Dbacks Wes Roemer RHP 53 Reds Kyle Lotzkar RHP 57 Padres Mitch Canham C 58 Angels Jon Bachanov RHP 60 Tigers Brandon Hamilton RHP 61 Dbacks Ed Easley C 62 Red Sox Ryan Dent SS 64 Padres Danny Payne OF

                    
No superstars in that group. In fact, Kozma probably helps this Cardinals team more than any other player on that list. If you look a little farther down the draft, you'll see guys like Stanton, J Zimmerman, and F Freeman in the 2nd, and Matt Moore and Anthony Rizzo in later rounds. But in terms of the players likely considered by the Cardinals at #18, I don't think the Kozma pick has turned out nearly as poorly as we thought it might.
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  #21  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:07 PM
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Ty Wiggington makes Kozma look like Babe Ruth.

Hell of a 3 pitch K looking AB by Ty.....
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  #22  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:13 PM
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Ty Wiggington makes Kozma look like Babe Ruth.

Hell of a 3 pitch K looking AB by Ty.....



He has hit Niese well in his career. He is a right handed hitter. The fact he sucks does not matter......
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  #23  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:20 PM
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Never saw a ground rule double like that at Busch before. Or anywhere else for that matter.
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  #24  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:38 PM
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Welp...got hosed on that call.
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  #25  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:43 PM
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At some point, we may have to resign ourselves to the fact that he can play baseball.
I nominate this for pithy post of the month!

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Old 05-16-2013, 02:45 PM
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Liberal economists are renowned for their ability to watch something work in practice and wondering if it will work in theory.
Conservative economists are renowned for their ability to watch their theories fail time and time again and still remain convinced they're right.
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"When women understand that governments and religions are human inventions; that bibles, prayer-books, catechisms, and encyclical letters are all emanations from the brain of man, they will no longer be oppressed by the injunctions that come to them with the divine authority of thus saith the Lord." Elizabeth Cady Stanton

"When you look at the history of what we know about the world, you see a very noticeable pattern. Natural explanations of things have been replacing supernatural explanations of them. Like a steamroller." Greta Christina
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  #27  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:48 PM
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No ground rule double and Ankiel should have been out at 2nd.
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  #28  
Old 05-16-2013, 02:51 PM
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Conservative economists are renowned for their ability to watch their theories fail time and time again and still remain convinced they're right.
You could be right, but no one has ever really given them a road test.
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Old 05-16-2013, 03:00 PM
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I would just DFA Salas today.

I've simply had enough.

It's the only way to keep him off the mound, as Mike simply will continue to bring him in.
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  #30  
Old 05-16-2013, 03:13 PM
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I would just DFA Salas today.

I've simply had enough.

It's the only way to keep him off the mound, as Mike simply will continue to bring him in.
Sanchez is back pitching at Memphis, but not that well....but he's still likely an upgrade over Salas....even Boggs has 5 scoreless innings at AAA.

Although in Mike defense...he clearly had only slight interest in winning today's game with the line-up he used....so it was a perfect time to let Salas pitch.
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  #31  
Old 05-16-2013, 03:14 PM
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Well hell a good spot for Beltran.

Where's them lightweight slap hitters when we need them to help pile on.
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  #32  
Old 05-16-2013, 03:20 PM
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Ouch.

You never want to say "Well, that's the ballgame" but fellas - that's probably the ballgame.
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  #33  
Old 05-16-2013, 03:23 PM
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Well there's an interesting graphic.

Number of earned runs against the last 5 LHSPs the Cardinals have faced --

2, 0, 1, 0, 2

Not exactly a murderers row, either. Niese, DeLaRosa, Wood, Locke, Detweiler.

Could the ol 'soft-tossing lefty' bugaboo be surfacing again? Freese struggling is surely a major part of it, as is Craig's early season power-outage.
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Old 05-16-2013, 03:31 PM
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Rich,

Liberal economists are renowned for their ability to watch something work in practice and wondering if it will work in theory.
He's got about 10 weeks of regular season games in the majors - 242 PA's.

Against that, is six years in the minors hitting just above the Mendoza Line, and even worse in the playoffs last fall. And subpar defense all around.

I'll go with the bigger sample size until the small sample size gets a lot bigger.
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Old 05-16-2013, 03:35 PM
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He's got about 10 weeks of regular season games in the majors - 242 PA's.

Against that, is six years in the minors hitting just above the Mendoza Line, and even worse in the playoffs last fall. And subpar defense all around.

I'll go with the bigger sample size until the small sample size gets a lot bigger.
I'm well aware of all of this, but Tyler Greene had that many plate appearances also. You know what I mean.
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Old 05-16-2013, 03:38 PM
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Conservative economists are renowned for their ability to watch their theories fail time and time again and still remain convinced they're right.
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  #37  
Old 05-16-2013, 03:56 PM
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You could be right, but no one has ever really given them a road test.
Oh, they've had a complete road test for more than 30 years.

We've been operating under Reagan's voodoo economics since 1981. The end result is more people living in poverty than at any time since the Great Depression. So much income inequality that even people with jobs can't spend enough to get the economy moving at a decent clip.

Then there are the experiments in Europe, where the conservative dogma of austerity during recession has sent one economy after another off the cliff.

On top of that, it was recently revealed that the study underpinning these policies reached its erroneous conclusions on the basis of a programming error in their Excel model. So-called "liberal economists" had criticized it right after it came out. Turns out they were right.
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"When women understand that governments and religions are human inventions; that bibles, prayer-books, catechisms, and encyclical letters are all emanations from the brain of man, they will no longer be oppressed by the injunctions that come to them with the divine authority of thus saith the Lord." Elizabeth Cady Stanton

"When you look at the history of what we know about the world, you see a very noticeable pattern. Natural explanations of things have been replacing supernatural explanations of them. Like a steamroller." Greta Christina

Last edited by redhat : 05-16-2013 at 03:58 PM.
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  #38  
Old 05-16-2013, 03:58 PM
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I'm well aware of all of this, but Tyler Greene had that many plate appearances also. You know what I mean.
I do, John, but...

It's all not much skin off my back, because one of two eventualities is what is likely to happen:

1) Koz will continue to confound his track record and my expectations and keep hitting well throughout the rest of the season, or

2) Koz comes crashing back down to earth, as I fear he will, and we have a hot Ryan Jackson to plug in as replacement and buy us time to see if something better can be traded for.

Either way, we'll be able to get by at short.
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Retire Joe Medwick's #7

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  #39  
Old 05-16-2013, 04:07 PM
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John D John D is offline
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Originally Posted by redhat View Post
Oh, they've had a complete road test for more than 30 years.

We've been operating under Reagan's voodoo economics since 1981. The end result is more people living in poverty than at any time since the Great Depression. So much income inequality that even people with jobs can't spend enough to get the economy moving at a decent clip.

Then there are the experiments in Europe, where the conservative dogma of austerity during recession has sent one economy after another off the cliff.

On top of that, it was recently revealed that the study underpinning these policies reached its erroneous conclusions on the basis of a programming error in their Excel model. So-called "liberal economists" had criticized it right after it came out. Turns out they were right.
Wake me up when someone actually tries to cut spending.
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  #40  
Old 05-16-2013, 04:17 PM
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GOOCH GOOCH is offline
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Originally Posted by redhat View Post
Oh, they've had a complete road test for more than 30 years.

We've been operating under Reagan's voodoo economics since 1981. The end result is more people living in poverty than at any time since the Great Depression. So much income inequality that even people with jobs can't spend enough to get the economy moving at a decent clip.

Then there are the experiments in Europe, where the conservative dogma of austerity during recession has sent one economy after another off the cliff.

On top of that, it was recently revealed that the study underpinning these policies reached its erroneous conclusions on the basis of a programming error in their Excel model. So-called "liberal economists" had criticized it right after it came out. Turns out they were right.
There is absolutely zero truth in the above. And that includes the "and"s and the "the"s. D.GOOCH
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  #41  
Old 05-16-2013, 05:01 PM
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Redbirdfan1 Redbirdfan1 is offline
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well, I was willing to give Wiggy a shot. I thought he could at least fill the RH PH slot and maybe hit lefty's here and there. It's time to cut bait on this guy. I still don't know why they gave him more than a yr but he's serving zero purpose and doesn't look anywhere near turning it around. When your 2 best highlights of the season are scoring a run and standing at the plate for a wild pitch...ugh
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Glad you brought up the military...now there's the most expensive welfare system in the country. And an awful lot of them don't pay income taxes, by the way. Mooching losers.
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  #42  
Old 05-16-2013, 05:24 PM
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Oz-iz-God Oz-iz-God is online now
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Wigginton was just a completely nonsensical signing from the jump.

DFA the guy, bring Jermaine Curtis back up and move along. Curtis's minor league profile suggests a guy that will give you a decent AB every time up. He's not going to put one out, but neither will this sorry ass we keep trotting out there.

At least Curtis might make contact or force a couple of extra pitches. Hell, he's probably a better IFer as well; he's spent most of his minor league career on the IF.

Actually - you know who I'd love to see get the call - Tommy Pham. There is so much raw talent in the guy. He has 20+ HR power, 15+ SB speed and an average to slightly above average feel for the strike zone. He can't be worse than Wigginton.
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Last edited by Oz-iz-God : 05-16-2013 at 05:30 PM.
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  #43  
Old 05-16-2013, 05:29 PM
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The Iguana The Iguana is offline
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Originally Posted by Oz-iz-God View Post
Wigginton was just a completely nonsensical signing from the jump.

DFA the guy, bring Jermaine Curtis back up and move along. Curtis's minor league profile suggests a guy that will give you a decent AB every time up. He's not going to put one out, but neither will this sorry ass we keep trotting out there.

At least Curtis might make contact or force a couple of extra pitches. Hell, he's probably a better IFer as well; he's spent most of his minor league career on the IF.

Actually - you know who I'd love to see get the call - Tommy Pham. There is so much raw talent in the guy. He has 20+ HR power, 20+ HR speed and an average to slightly above average feel for the strike zone. He can't be worse than Wigginton.
Amen, brother.

I've become more and intrigued with Pham.

Wigs has shot his bolt.
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Retire Joe Medwick's #7

"I have discovered, in twenty years of moving around a ball park, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats." - Bill Veeck
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - Craig Calcaterra
"Whoever wants to know the heart and mind of America had better learn baseball." -Jacques Barzun
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  #44  
Old 05-16-2013, 05:32 PM
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Oz-iz-God Oz-iz-God is online now
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Originally Posted by The Iguana View Post
Amen, brother.

I've become more and intrigued with Pham.

Wigs has shot his bolt.
I've been keeping an eye on him since he tore up Springfield upon his callup in 2010. I really thought last year was the end. He'd had so many injuries and it sure looked like a bum shoulder would be the end of him. Shoulders have felled many a fine young player and I figured we'd see the last we'd ever hear from ol' Tommy (now Thomas) Pham.

But by all accounts he's looked as good or better than ever this year. He should be in AAA tomorrow and getting a long look to replace Wiggy when Moe finally admits how wrong he was there.
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The foregoing statements are the lay opinions of me, a moderately educated mid-westerner with no experience in the field of professional athletics or psychology. I did, however, stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
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  #45  
Old 05-16-2013, 06:13 PM
barnbird barnbird is offline
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The Choate signing in comparison looks better every day.
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  #46  
Old 05-16-2013, 08:08 PM
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Sonicblast12 Sonicblast12 is offline
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Originally Posted by The Iguana View Post
Amen, brother.

I've become more and intrigued with Pham.

Wigs has shot his bolt.
I think Pham has been in the system for 43 years.
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